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	<title>Comments on: B&amp;D Ski Crampons &#8211; Part Two</title>
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	<link>http://www.wildsnow.com/861/bd-ski-crampons-part-two/</link>
	<description>Backcountry Skiing Weblog Blog, FAQs, more, links and info about randonnee, telemark and backcountry ski mountaineering.</description>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Shefftz</title>
		<link>http://www.wildsnow.com/861/bd-ski-crampons-part-two/comment-page-1/#comment-15546</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Shefftz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Apr 2009 14:27:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=861#comment-15546</guid>
		<description>&quot;So how are you guys mounting the tlt round spacers to the crampon?&quot;

Details are in my upcoming guest blog; draft excerpt follows below:

*****

The B&amp;D “100mm” crampon actually measures 103mm inside, which matches up with the website’s information (i.e., interior clearance is 3mm in excess of the stated width).  Weight including the lower-height spacers (and mounting screws) is 9.8 ounces.  The thickness of the metal is about 2.6mm.
The Dynafit wide crampon measures about 108mm inside.  Weight including spacers (i.e., TLT Speed/Classic heel post extensions) and fasteners (hardware store T-Nut with Brad hole 6-32 x 1 ¼ plus corresponding machine screws, no drilling required) is 8.0 ounces, so almost two ounces less than B&amp;D despite being 5mm wider.  The thickness of the metal is about 2.5mm.
[Note that Dynafit has never included spacers with their crampons, and explains this is because they advise against using the crampons with the bindings in the higher heel elevator position.  I agree with this advice:  ski crampons are intended for traversing skin tracks, not going straight up.  And if you’re on a skin track with firmer snow -- i.e., ski crampon territory -- the higher heel elevator position will create a less stable platform.  However, I have been in some situations that merited keeping the uphill ski binding in the lower heel elevator position but the downhill ski binding in the higher heel elevator position:  this differential helps to even out the disparity in the downhill ski being lower than the uphill ski.  Moreover, using the ski crampons with spacers in a Comfort or Vertical ST/FT binding is creating essentially the same snow penetration or “bite” as using the ski crampons without spacers in the original TLT IV/Speed/Classic binding, which has less stand height.]
As shown in the various pictures, the Dynafit wide crampon is just a wider version of the current “92” (with ~87mm interior clearance) crampon but with the front “tooth” eliminated.  The snow penetration or “bite” with the TLT spacers is essentially the same as the B&amp;D crampons with the lower-height spacers, although the teeth configuration is quite different.  When I was ski cramponing along on some flatter terrain with the Dynafit crampon on one ski and the B&amp;D on the other, I tried concentrating on which crampon had less drag, but I wasn’t able to discern any difference on shorter stretches.  
Since the B&amp;D crampons are just metal sheets bent into shape, they can be nested together for packing, entailing a little bit of splaying out in one crampon.  (One approach is to tuck the nested crampons together underneath a pack strap, then secure the package in place by clipping a biner through the pack strap and the cutout in the crampons.)  The Dynafit crampons have significant contours in the metal and do not splay very easily, hence they can’t be nested for packing.  The upside of this is that I’ve never heard of a Dynafit crampon bending or breaking.  By contrast, B&amp;D crampons are supposed to be reinforced for this year, but their crampons in prior years have suffered from crippling bends.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;So how are you guys mounting the tlt round spacers to the crampon?&#8221;</p>
<p>Details are in my upcoming guest blog; draft excerpt follows below:</p>
<p>*****</p>
<p>The B&amp;D “100mm” crampon actually measures 103mm inside, which matches up with the website’s information (i.e., interior clearance is 3mm in excess of the stated width).  Weight including the lower-height spacers (and mounting screws) is 9.8 ounces.  The thickness of the metal is about 2.6mm.<br />
The Dynafit wide crampon measures about 108mm inside.  Weight including spacers (i.e., TLT Speed/Classic heel post extensions) and fasteners (hardware store T-Nut with Brad hole 6-32 x 1 ¼ plus corresponding machine screws, no drilling required) is 8.0 ounces, so almost two ounces less than B&amp;D despite being 5mm wider.  The thickness of the metal is about 2.5mm.<br />
[Note that Dynafit has never included spacers with their crampons, and explains this is because they advise against using the crampons with the bindings in the higher heel elevator position.  I agree with this advice:  ski crampons are intended for traversing skin tracks, not going straight up.  And if you’re on a skin track with firmer snow -- i.e., ski crampon territory -- the higher heel elevator position will create a less stable platform.  However, I have been in some situations that merited keeping the uphill ski binding in the lower heel elevator position but the downhill ski binding in the higher heel elevator position:  this differential helps to even out the disparity in the downhill ski being lower than the uphill ski.  Moreover, using the ski crampons with spacers in a Comfort or Vertical ST/FT binding is creating essentially the same snow penetration or “bite” as using the ski crampons without spacers in the original TLT IV/Speed/Classic binding, which has less stand height.]<br />
As shown in the various pictures, the Dynafit wide crampon is just a wider version of the current “92” (with ~87mm interior clearance) crampon but with the front “tooth” eliminated.  The snow penetration or “bite” with the TLT spacers is essentially the same as the B&amp;D crampons with the lower-height spacers, although the teeth configuration is quite different.  When I was ski cramponing along on some flatter terrain with the Dynafit crampon on one ski and the B&amp;D on the other, I tried concentrating on which crampon had less drag, but I wasn’t able to discern any difference on shorter stretches.<br />
Since the B&amp;D crampons are just metal sheets bent into shape, they can be nested together for packing, entailing a little bit of splaying out in one crampon.  (One approach is to tuck the nested crampons together underneath a pack strap, then secure the package in place by clipping a biner through the pack strap and the cutout in the crampons.)  The Dynafit crampons have significant contours in the metal and do not splay very easily, hence they can’t be nested for packing.  The upside of this is that I’ve never heard of a Dynafit crampon bending or breaking.  By contrast, B&amp;D crampons are supposed to be reinforced for this year, but their crampons in prior years have suffered from crippling bends.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.wildsnow.com/861/bd-ski-crampons-part-two/comment-page-1/#comment-15545</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Apr 2009 13:06:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=861#comment-15545</guid>
		<description>Salami cutting station, Brilliant! 

So how are you guys mounting the tlt round spacers to the crampon? 

Nut and bolt? 

Looks like that would require drilling the holes in the crampon bigger.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Salami cutting station, Brilliant! </p>
<p>So how are you guys mounting the tlt round spacers to the crampon? </p>
<p>Nut and bolt? </p>
<p>Looks like that would require drilling the holes in the crampon bigger.</p>
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		<title>By: Lou</title>
		<link>http://www.wildsnow.com/861/bd-ski-crampons-part-two/comment-page-1/#comment-15543</link>
		<dc:creator>Lou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Apr 2009 23:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=861#comment-15543</guid>
		<description>I just heard from Dynafit. No spacers are sold with the cramps. Why? They don&#039;t recommend using them with high lift. That&#039;s of course just their take, not necessarily reality for you WildSnowers. Thus, please know that indeed the small plastic disks that come with Dynafit TLT/speed bindings make excellent spacers, or you can make a spacer out of plastic cutting board or whatever. Or, get a set of spacers from B&amp;D, drill two holes per crampon, and you&#039;ve got a finished looking product. But I like the cutting board idea. After all, what would a state of art ski binding be without a chunk of cutting board to top it off? It&#039;s always good to have a place to slice salami. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just heard from Dynafit. No spacers are sold with the cramps. Why? They don&#8217;t recommend using them with high lift. That&#8217;s of course just their take, not necessarily reality for you WildSnowers. Thus, please know that indeed the small plastic disks that come with Dynafit TLT/speed bindings make excellent spacers, or you can make a spacer out of plastic cutting board or whatever. Or, get a set of spacers from B&#038;D, drill two holes per crampon, and you&#8217;ve got a finished looking product. But I like the cutting board idea. After all, what would a state of art ski binding be without a chunk of cutting board to top it off? It&#8217;s always good to have a place to slice salami.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Lou</title>
		<link>http://www.wildsnow.com/861/bd-ski-crampons-part-two/comment-page-1/#comment-15542</link>
		<dc:creator>Lou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Apr 2009 22:28:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=861#comment-15542</guid>
		<description>I swear I got some Dynafit cramps some time ago that had the spacer disks in the baggie. Perhaps I&#039;m dreaming. Whatever the case, apparently they don&#039;t come with them any more and it&#039;s time for some blogging about that! Jonathan, fire me the content that guest blog ASAP and I&#039;ll get it up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I swear I got some Dynafit cramps some time ago that had the spacer disks in the baggie. Perhaps I&#8217;m dreaming. Whatever the case, apparently they don&#8217;t come with them any more and it&#8217;s time for some blogging about that! Jonathan, fire me the content that guest blog ASAP and I&#8217;ll get it up.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jonathan Shefftz</title>
		<link>http://www.wildsnow.com/861/bd-ski-crampons-part-two/comment-page-1/#comment-15541</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Shefftz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Apr 2009 21:59:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=861#comment-15541</guid>
		<description>I have never seen any Dynafit ski crampons come equipped with spacers.  Instead, I use the spacers that come with the TLT Speed/Classic bindings along with some fasteners from a hardware store.  (Upcoming guest blog on the new Dynafit wide crampons vs the B&amp;D aftermarket crampons complete with some AK ski touring footage  - once I write it all up...)

BTW:
“I’m a hinged crampon guy (with a shock cord loop fastened to the crampon and run over the toe of the boot to pull the crampon out of the snow when striding.)”
- This strikes me as entirely unnecessary.  When the boot is not pressing down on the crampon, the crampon just bounces along on the surface.  Any efficiency from that level of drag is far less than the potential trouble caused with the shock cord jerryrigging.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have never seen any Dynafit ski crampons come equipped with spacers.  Instead, I use the spacers that come with the TLT Speed/Classic bindings along with some fasteners from a hardware store.  (Upcoming guest blog on the new Dynafit wide crampons vs the B&amp;D aftermarket crampons complete with some AK ski touring footage  &#8211; once I write it all up&#8230;)</p>
<p>BTW:<br />
“I’m a hinged crampon guy (with a shock cord loop fastened to the crampon and run over the toe of the boot to pull the crampon out of the snow when striding.)”<br />
- This strikes me as entirely unnecessary.  When the boot is not pressing down on the crampon, the crampon just bounces along on the surface.  Any efficiency from that level of drag is far less than the potential trouble caused with the shock cord jerryrigging.</p>
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