Comments on: Backcountry Avalanches http://www.wildsnow.com/86/backcountry-avalanches/ Backcountry Skiing Weblog Blog, FAQs, more, links and info about randonnee, telemark and backcountry ski mountaineering. Thu, 09 Feb 2012 05:43:15 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Michael Kennedy http://www.wildsnow.com/86/backcountry-avalanches/comment-page-1/#comment-63 Michael Kennedy Wed, 04 Jan 2006 12:59:27 +0000 http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=86#comment-63 Here's some heresy: Get a group together. Leave your beacons, shovels, and probes at home. Go on a ski tour. Chances are good that you'll pick an ultra-safe route. You'll pay close attention to the weather and avalanche forecast that day. You'll travel one at a time in any area even remotely threatened by avalanche. You'll go with a small group you really trust, and you'll communicate constantly. You'll watch out for one another. You'll err (very far) on the side of caution. You might also get a sense of how much we all depend on our equipment to give us a sense of comfort and security in the backcountry. And maybe a reminder that the most important bit of gear is the one we carry between our ears. I'd be thrilled if I could someday look back at 40 or 50 years of backcountry skiing and say, "I've never been caught in a slide, nor have any of my partners." I'd be even more thrilled if I could say, "I've never even had a close call, nor have any of my partners," but it's too late for that. Here’s some heresy:

Get a group together. Leave your beacons, shovels, and probes at home. Go on a ski tour.

Chances are good that you’ll pick an ultra-safe route. You’ll pay close attention to the weather and avalanche forecast that day. You’ll travel one at a time in any area even remotely threatened by avalanche. You’ll go with a small group you really trust, and you’ll communicate constantly. You’ll watch out for one another. You’ll err (very far) on the side of caution.

You might also get a sense of how much we all depend on our equipment to give us a sense of comfort and security in the backcountry. And maybe a reminder that the most important bit of gear is the one we carry between our ears.

I’d be thrilled if I could someday look back at 40 or 50 years of backcountry skiing and say, “I’ve never been caught in a slide, nor have any of my partners.” I’d be even more thrilled if I could say, “I’ve never even had a close call, nor have any of my partners,” but it’s too late for that.

]]> By: AKBC http://www.wildsnow.com/86/backcountry-avalanches/comment-page-1/#comment-61 AKBC Wed, 04 Jan 2006 01:17:38 +0000 http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=86#comment-61 aha! I told you sledders are more dangerous! ; ) But seriously though, I think Mark's comment regarding technology making us feel safer is part of the problem (particularly when the technology is a super fast sled) but also the fact that snowmachines are one more level of disconnect from the environment. Recently, an avy rescue professional related a story of teaching a sled-specific avy class in which he had trouble convincing the participants to get off their sleds to feel the snow! I think the bigger problem illustrated here is not the group dynamic issue (which is legitimate nonetheless) but the issue of not being prepared for the BC, a problem sledders seem to suffer from more than any other user group. aha! I told you sledders are more dangerous! ; ) But seriously though, I think Mark’s comment regarding technology making us feel safer is part of the problem (particularly when the technology is a super fast sled) but also the fact that snowmachines are one more level of disconnect from the environment. Recently, an avy rescue professional related a story of teaching a sled-specific avy class in which he had trouble convincing the participants to get off their sleds to feel the snow! I think the bigger problem illustrated here is not the group dynamic issue (which is legitimate nonetheless) but the issue of not being prepared for the BC, a problem sledders seem to suffer from more than any other user group.

]]> By: ham http://www.wildsnow.com/86/backcountry-avalanches/comment-page-1/#comment-60 ham Tue, 03 Jan 2006 21:46:11 +0000 http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=86#comment-60 I hate to be pessimist, but I'm not sure that we'll ever see avalanche accident numbers go down, especially as backcountry use explodes. The unfortunate reality of gaining knowledge about avalanches is that it only comes after a lot of experience. I always considered myself a pretty responsible skier, reading every avalanche book and taking classes but it took a partial burial before my eyes were really opened. Many people, especially in a relatively stable maritime climate, have bad habits continually reinforced because they never experience an avalanche, until the big one. I can't tell you how many well-read and self-described experienced skiers I've been with who shred bowls in big groups or otherwise disregard safety. The other problem with bc skiing or sledding is that it's a game of managing and balancing risk and as safe as we want to be, that balance sometimes gets tipped and if we're lucky then we get to learn from it. I hate to be pessimist, but I’m not sure that we’ll ever see avalanche accident numbers go down, especially as backcountry use explodes. The unfortunate reality of gaining knowledge about avalanches is that it only comes after a lot of experience. I always considered myself a pretty responsible skier, reading every avalanche book and taking classes but it took a partial burial before my eyes were really opened. Many people, especially in a relatively stable maritime climate, have bad habits continually reinforced because they never experience an avalanche, until the big one. I can’t tell you how many well-read and self-described experienced skiers I’ve been with who shred bowls in big groups or otherwise disregard safety. The other problem with bc skiing or sledding is that it’s a game of managing and balancing risk and as safe as we want to be, that balance sometimes gets tipped and if we’re lucky then we get to learn from it.

]]> By: Sky http://www.wildsnow.com/86/backcountry-avalanches/comment-page-1/#comment-58 Sky Tue, 03 Jan 2006 17:37:43 +0000 http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=86#comment-58 Like Brian, I would still go skiing with a forgotten beacon. It might severely modify the day's itinerary and I'd just be a little extra cautious. Not that one should change their behavior because of a beacon... But excellent point about one-at-a-time methods when the risk is there. I've seen the one-at-a-time protocol possibly save a friend's life. Route-finding is also very important. It seems like it might be the MOST important thing for people who still want to ski given higher avalanche hazard. Nothing you can do to MAKE people cure their ignorance and save their own lives. Just don't put yourself at their mercy when you're out there. Sometimes route-finding could mean breaking a new skin track to get away from others who could put you at risk, or breaking a new skin track that gets away from a track taking a bad route. Always good to lay a new skin track! Oh yeah, where can I get my t-shirt? I think I've earned it many times. Then you'll know to avoid me. Like Brian, I would still go skiing with a forgotten beacon. It might severely modify the day’s itinerary and I’d just be a little extra cautious. Not that one should change their behavior because of a beacon…

But excellent point about one-at-a-time methods when the risk is there. I’ve seen the one-at-a-time protocol possibly save a friend’s life. Route-finding is also very important. It seems like it might be the MOST important thing for people who still want to ski given higher avalanche hazard.

Nothing you can do to MAKE people cure their ignorance and save their own lives. Just don’t put yourself at their mercy when you’re out there. Sometimes route-finding could mean breaking a new skin track to get away from others who could put you at risk, or breaking a new skin track that gets away from a track taking a bad route. Always good to lay a new skin track!

Oh yeah, where can I get my t-shirt? I think I’ve earned it many times. Then you’ll know to avoid me.

]]> By: Lou http://www.wildsnow.com/86/backcountry-avalanches/comment-page-1/#comment-57 Lou Tue, 03 Jan 2006 16:51:16 +0000 http://www.wildsnow.com/?p=86#comment-57 Exposing more than one person at a time is not doing the right thing. Not carrying a beacon and rescue gear is wrong. And come to think of it, the boys could have taken a much more avalanche safe route while moving below Kelso peak. Harsh? Yes. But I'll bet if one kid could be saved by learning from these other kid's mistakes, such harsh assessment is worth it. And who cares if they were retreating or not -- all that means is they were being exposed to the same hazard twice instead of once. If they'd retreated while still down in the trees, that would have been a different story. Exposing more than one person at a time is not doing the right thing. Not carrying a beacon and rescue gear is wrong. And come to think of it, the boys could have taken a much more avalanche safe route while moving below Kelso peak. Harsh? Yes. But I’ll bet if one kid could be saved by learning from these other kid’s mistakes, such harsh assessment is worth it. And who cares if they were retreating or not — all that means is they were being exposed to the same hazard twice instead of once. If they’d retreated while still down in the trees, that would have been a different story.

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