WildSnow Tech FAQ — Dynafit Manaslu Mounting


This post by WildSnow.com blogger  

I love my Dynafit Manaslu skis — an amazing combo of weight and performance. But they do have one possibly confusing aspect: That of the “pre-drilled” binding mount “holes.” Here be a little something to clear up confusion about this excellent and useful feature.

- Binding mount area on Manaslu is reinforced with a metal “Titanal” plate (basically a thin sheet of high quality aluminum alloy). Location of front plate shown below, with added Sharpie marker lines for clarity.

Location of front Titanal plate on Manaslu ski.

Location of front Titanal plate on Manaslu ski.

- Manaslu comes from factory with what could be called “holes” for binding mounting. These are actually nylon plugs (“preset binding inserts”) located in the core material below the Titanal plate, and a dip in the top sheet over the plugs makes them look like “holes.” The plugs indeed have a channel that acts as a screw hole. They do not need to be drilled when mounting, but I’ve found it logical to punch the top skin with an awl before inserting the screw.

- The inserts are glass reinforced nylon plastic and regular thread cutting screws are used for for binding mounting. Thus, the Manaslu inserts are not intended for continuous use but rather a limited number of mounts. We don’t have a hard number for this, but I’d say it is between six and ten. Use of epoxy will extend this limit, as will care with not over tightening and stripping the screws.

Cutaway of Manaslu core plug inserts.

Cutaway of Manaslu core plug inserts.

- Manaslu preset binding inserts are warranted and intended for use with Dynafit Vertical ST / FT / Comfort bindings.

- Inserts in Manaslu 178 and 187 length skis, with recommended Dynafit bindings (per above), fit boot 294 to 343 mm sole length (approximately 26.0 to 30.5 depending on brand). In 169 length, they accommodate boots from 274 to 323 mm sole length (approximately 25.0 to 28.5 depending on brand).

- Using the existing nylon inserts results in a mount is quite a bit stronger than drilling your own holes in the titanal plate area.

- If you drill outside the Manaslu preset inserts, then your mount is not under
warranty. Nonetheless, I’m certain that if done correctly nearly any binding can be mounted on a Manaslu without problems. (Caveat: We’re talking about skis in normal use, not hospital air with Marker Dukes set to DIN 13.)

- Drilling your own holes and mounting bindings in the Titanal plate area is ok so long as this is done by an expert mechanic who uses the correct bit for a metal top skin, taps the holes, mounts with epoxy and doesn’t over tighten the screws. Last winter, many Manaslu skis were tested with bindings such as Duke and Fritschi, mounted without using the nylon inserts. By all reports these mounts held up fine.

- Drilling holes outside the Titanal plate area may be necessary for bindings such as Fritschi, due to the rear latch of the binding being some distance rearward. In this case it’s best to get a few of the screws to still locate through the Titanal.

- In the case of larger skiers who require longer bindings, the Fritschi and Duke may locate with some or even all screws outside the area of the Titanal plate at front or rear (depending on where the foot is positioned on the ski). In this case we would conditionally recommend mounting based on the style of the skier and their weight. Very large and aggressive skiers should definitely consider that the rear of the Fritschi is only held with three screws, while bindings such as the Dynafit FT12 are held by four screws that will locate in the inserts (unless they’re using a boot larger than 30.5.)

- The Titanal binding area insert (diamond shaped plate) of the Manaslu is thicker than a normal “Titanal top sheet” ski. Under the Titanal plate, the ski has stringers running vertically as seen through the window in graphics near front and rear of ski. The lighter color is a lightweight manmade fiber and the dark color is Pawlonia wood. Depending on what non-Dynafit binding you’re mounting, the material the binding binding mounting screws end up in will vary. So long as the holes are correctly sized, and the screws epoxied and not over-tightened, our opinion is that screws will hold fine in either material. Again, all with epoxy and careful installation.

Summary: With care about how large and aggressive a given skier is, we feel nearly any ski binding configuration can be mounted on the Manaslu.

Support WildSnow, shop for Dynafit Manaslu here.

Comments

168 Responses to “WildSnow Tech FAQ — Dynafit Manaslu Mounting”

  1. Kirk October 17th, 2008 10:52 am

    Cool, I have these skis in hand and new FT12 bindings on the way! Still might flinch and have a professional do the mount as I have ZZero skills in that department but it gives me hope even I could do it right!

  2. Lou October 17th, 2008 12:41 pm

    Kirk, your bindings will most likely mount using the inserts. If so, it’s quite easy to do the mount but there are a few gotchas. Mainly, you have to know how to line up the boot by gradually tightening the front screws, and you have to be super careful not to over tighten. Just make sure the pro you find to mount them is actually a pro who’s mounted Dynafits before and had good results. I can’t tell you how many hack jobs I’ve seen that were done at ski shops.

  3. Andy October 17th, 2008 1:25 pm

    If I’m reading correctly, the smallest boot that you could use the inserts for on a 178 is one with a 294mm BSL?

  4. Lou October 17th, 2008 2:13 pm

    That is correct. Smaller than 294 and you drill your own holes at at least one end or the other. My point is that drilling your own holes, especially for a smaller person, is no big deal, and okay for most normal to larger folks as well.

  5. Matus October 19th, 2008 3:49 pm

    A note regarding inserts. I ripped out the TLT Comfort from the ski (due to wrong mounting). It was a disaster since this happened with new Movement skis. In a local ski service, they calmed me down completely – and remounted the binding with the plastic inserts (it took 10 minutes). They assured me that a plastic insert is much stronger than classic drilling+gluing. And, according to a service man, it is not possible to overtighten the screws by hand (I am not sure with this but when mounting, I was not very gentle:). One insert costs about EUR 3. No titanal plate is required, although I understand that it adds a bit of confidence.

  6. Piotr October 20th, 2008 1:18 am

    One thing to consider when mounting outside of the titanal plate would be to possibly switch to using smaller drill bit (3.6mm). But the trick is one would have to know exactly where the plate is so that holes diameter match their location (to avoid both loose mount and volcano-ing). A method that comes to my mind would be to drill with 3.6, see if there is metal inside, if yes, re-drill with 4.1.

  7. Lou October 20th, 2008 6:31 am

    The plate is obvious when you’re looking at it in person, I marked it because I couldn’t get a photo that showed it that well, due to it being black on black.

  8. Marty Rood November 2nd, 2008 2:36 pm

    I am getting ready to mount some ST Dynafit bindings on some 178 Manaslu skis. You mentioned several tricks to mounting. Other than lining up the boot toe piece when tightening, are there any other tricks or specs for getting it right? Any suggestions are welcome!

  9. Lou November 2nd, 2008 4:26 pm

    Use a bit of 1-hour epoxy (so you have time to mess around) and don’t over torque!!! Those are the two big tricks. Oh, and do the heel unit first, that way you have something to line up with… Let us know how it goes. Photo? Sounds like a nice rig!

  10. Ron Laine November 7th, 2008 1:45 pm

    Lou:
    My shop is having trouble mounting my new Scarpa Spirit 4′s (mondo 26.5) with FT’s to the Manaslu’s. They are saying the boot size falls inbetween the screw mounts and will need to be drilled either on one end or the other. Can the shop pick the screw holes that are best fit and make up the slack with a binding adjustment, or will we need to drill one end? I think the problem comes from the fact that the holes are designed to fit Zues boots which do not come in half sizes like the Scarpa’s do.
    Thanks,
    Ron

  11. Lou November 7th, 2008 3:10 pm

    Ron, how far off the ski mark does the boot center mark fall if using best case with the inserts? And does it fall forward or behind the mark on ski?

    The fact your shop says “drill on one end or the other” confuses me. As I can’t imagine why you’d have a choice.

    Snap a binding on the toe of the boot. Set the boot on the ski. Line up the boot mark with the ski mark. See where the binding falls in relation to the inserts. Then get back to us with specifics.

    Or, if your mind works differently than that: Snap binding on boot toe. Line up binding with best case set of inserts, let us know how far the boot mark is from the ski mark, and in what direction.

  12. mike b November 7th, 2008 4:14 pm

    When I picked up the ski and pinched the area where the toe would be mounted I noticed that the ski took a nosedive (behind the ‘balance point’), leading me to believe that when mounted and a foot is lifted, the tip would do the same.
    Also, looking at the ski it seems at least a few cm’s too far back? Any experience on this issue?

    The nice folks at dynafit were kind enough to include a rough size guide for which set of holes to use when using any of the binders with a larger adjustment range. Do you have any suggestions for mounting a classic/speed on this ski?

    i noticed you mentioned that they are designed for the other bindings, but in my opinion the speed classic is superior because of durability in all areas except the ski crampon slot.

  13. Lou November 7th, 2008 4:27 pm

    Mike, I’ve found it’s just not necessary to use balance as criteria for mounting. But if you need to do that, perhaps the Manaslu is not for you as it has a big long tip and is going to be tip heavy because of that. For the same reason, the binding mount position will appear to be too far back.

    As for mounting a Classic, just figure out where you want you boot to be on the ski, and position the binding accordingly.

    The Speed/TLT/Classic is something we still love. I’ve got quite a few pair that are still going strong, that we swap from test ski to test ski throughout the winter.

  14. mike b November 7th, 2008 4:32 pm

    Your absolutely right that a balance pt isn’t really used outside of the nordic world.
    I’ve noticed that many ‘boot center’ lines seem to be a ways back because of the soft/large tip. I have a pair of 181 coomba’s that I’m feeling like are a ways too far in the rear, mounted at the factory line.

    On a related note, I know your reviews were very positive about the manaslu’s soft snow performance. How would you compare it all around to the Baker superlight? I skied a ton on the superlight last year, but as with many light skis I wasn’t really impressed when it was firm or at all variable. I’m looking for a new everyday CO ski and am considering the man’

  15. Lou November 7th, 2008 4:43 pm

    I would not say the Manaslu is any better than the Baker SL on firm. As for myself, I’d give the edge on firm to the SL, though as you say it’s not a ski you’re going to be charging down the ski resort on like something more dedicated to hardpack. I’d give the soft snow edge to the Manaslu. Both cross over, that’s what makes them useful for backcountry…

  16. Mike K November 7th, 2008 4:46 pm

    Hi Lou, I just ordered a pair of Manaslu skis, I’m very stoked. I too noticed that the mounting point seems pretty far back compared to other skis. Since you have a lot of time on these already do you find they ski like you are in the back seat all the time? I’m sure being a little back in powder is fine but could be tough in wind blasted hardpack conditions.
    Also I ordered Garmont Megaride boots, do you think that will be a good match to drive such a wide ski?
    Looking forward to my new ultralight set up.

  17. Lee Lau November 8th, 2008 11:58 am

    I skied the Manaslu with Mega Rides and with the Dynafit ZZeus

    See this post re balance point

    Both boots were a good match with the ski

  18. Brian G December 11th, 2008 12:59 pm

    Hey everybody, this is my 1st post here.. I wanted to say thanks for all the information you have put together here. I have heard nothing but good things about your website from many people and was hoping someone could help me out. I have a pair of 178 Manaslu skis and am hoping to mount size small Marker Barons to them. None of the binding holes line up with the predrilled holes on the plate of the ski, and I was curious if anyone else has done this already? Also was hoping to get some more opinions on using epoxy to set the moutning screws? Thanks

  19. Lou December 11th, 2008 1:29 pm

    Hi Brian, thanks so much for visiting. I’m sure we get get you going on that. So long as your holes go through the Titanal binding plate you’ll be okay. Tap the holes and use epoxy for sure. If some of the holes don’t go through the Titanal, you might still be ok but that depends on your size and intended use.

    So, do all the holes end through the Titanal?

  20. Brian G December 11th, 2008 4:34 pm

    In order for the Barons not to line up in between any of the predrilled holes, two or the nine screws are going to be outside of the plate. I havent used epoxy to set the screws before, is there a particular brand or type to use? I plan on eventually using the skis for backcounty use only, but will probably use them at a resort initially.

  21. Brian G December 11th, 2008 4:35 pm

    Two of the nine screws are going to be outside of the plate, sorry typo there in previous message

  22. Lou December 11th, 2008 5:04 pm

    Brian, what type of use and DIN are we talking? What weight height are you?

    As for epoxy, just use any 1-hour from the hardware store. Work it into the holes with a toothpick or something, heat screws with a soldering iron if ever removing.

  23. Brian G December 11th, 2008 7:37 pm

    Once I’m comfortable with the skis I’d like to save them for powder or corn snow in the spring. I have other skis I can use on the hardpack. I weigh 168 right now, and am 5′ 11 height. The other alpine skis I have are set at 8.5, so I was thinking I would set the barons at 7 or 8 and try that?

  24. Lou December 11th, 2008 9:28 pm

    Brian, sounds like you’ll be fine with a couple of screws outside the mount zone. Remember that does void the warranty, but generally works fine unless the mount is done with poor craftsman ship or the user is huge/bigDIN/agro.

  25. Jonathan S. Shefftz December 29th, 2008 8:13 pm

    My 169cm just arrived — crazy light at 5 lb 11 oz — even lighter than my 164cm Trab Duo Free Rando?!?
    – For finding the right fore/aft balance point, I’m a 296mm bsl in the 169cm, so the sticker recommends the fore heel position and aft toe position. However, using my Dynafit jig to measure, to be in the center of the binding adjustment range I should actually be either fore on both toe & heel or aft on both toe & heel.
    – My solution would usually be to measure the boot’s Ball-of-Foot against the ski’s running length, but with the tip rocker, hmm… so instead I measured against a 170cm BD Verdict (which BoF had me mount 0.5cm fore of boot center mark) and 168cm Atomic Kongur (which BoF had me mount 3cm fore of boot center mark), and roughly adjusted for the slight length differences from the 169cm Manaslu. The fore position (i.e., recommended for boots 3mm longer than mine) would puts me 3cm aft of those other skis that were mounted to Bof, so I’m going to try that first (instead of the even further aft position for my boot size).

  26. colin chisholm January 5th, 2009 10:37 pm

    Thanks for all the info. I just bought 187 Manaslus but haven’t mounted them yet. My boots are the Scarpa F3, and my understanding is that I need to mount a shim behind the Dynafit Vertical toe piece, which is what I did on my other setup. Is it okay for me to mount the shim outside of the designated mounting area on the Manaslu? Is the shim necessary? Cheers, Colin

  27. Jonathan S. Shefftz January 5th, 2009 10:48 pm

    “My boots are the Scarpa F3, and my understanding is that I need to mount a shim behind the Dynafit Vertical toe piece, which is what I did on my other setup. Is it okay for me to mount the shim outside of the designated mounting area on the Manaslu? Is the shim necessary?”
    – Correct.
    – Yes. (The shim requires far far less than hold down strength than the binding.)
    – Yes. (Besides the general bounciness, but danger of prereleasing.)
    Also, not that you asked, but the shim options are:
    – screw in Scarpa’s standard shim
    – buy the sliding shim so that you can swap in ski crampons easily
    – get some LPDE plastic sheets and make your own custom shims (though be careful that your boot lugs won’t get caught up on a small shim)

  28. Lou January 6th, 2009 2:16 am

    Or, make a mini-shim out of an old TLT heel riser or crampon spacer disk (why we save everything).

  29. chris January 24th, 2009 9:55 pm

    just got my manaslus in a couple of days ago. i’m gonna mount some ft 12′s on them for a bsl of 310 (megarides). am i to understand that no epoxy is necessary if i’m using the inserts, which i plan to do? is epoxy recommended even if not necessary? anything to look out for other than lining the bindings up properly so that are parallel with the ski edge?

  30. Ali E February 4th, 2009 9:25 am

    Hi Lou

    I just received a new pair 178 cm Manaslus and I am mightily confused about where to mount the bindings. I will be fitting Dynafit Comfort bindings to the skis to take Scarpa Spirit 3 boots. The boots are 320mm along the sole, so according to the sticker on the skis, I should be mounting the toepiece on the frontmost set of holes and the heelpiece on the rearmost set (ie the max possible length).

    Now here’s the confusing bit: Just out of interest I lined up the Manaslus against my old Movement Evolution skis (177 cm), which still have the Comforts mounted for the same Scarpa boots. When I line up the toepiece screws on the Comforts (ie on the Movements) to where the foremost holes are on the Manaslu, the heelpiece screws line up with the forward set of holes on the Manaslu plate, instead of the rearmost ones. Now I appreciate the Comfort binding can be adjusted for length, but my question is this: Should I mount the Comforts as instructed on the sticker and adjust the length, or should I mount them in the mixed configuration described above? Which is more important to get right, the toepiece or the heel? (Presumably the toe as this is fixed, while the heelpiece is adjustable to different boot lengths.)

    Another interesting point: When I line the skis up in the way described above, the Movements sit a good 6 cm (2.5″) further back than the Manaslus. Presumably this has something to do with the Manaslus’ running length?

    I can send a photo if that helps. Thanks for any advice.

  31. Lou February 4th, 2009 10:45 am

    Ali, with a boot that long you indeed need to use the front set of inserts to mount the binding toe on the ski so your foot ends up in the correct place on the ski. It really doesn’t matter which rear inserts you use so long as the binding can be adjusted to the length of your boot.

    If you can adjust the binding correctly for length using either set of rear inserts, then perhaps pick the set that might allow you to use another boot at some point. Otherwise just follow instructions, or flip a coin.

    Also, remember that it’s sometimes worth trying different mounting positions with the Manaslu or any ski. Try using the front set of inserts for the binding toe, if you don’t like the way they ski, try the rear inserts in the front set, thus moving your foot back on the ski.

    As for comparing binding position from one ski/brand/model to another by placing skis side-by-side, that’s nuts.

  32. Ali E February 4th, 2009 11:18 am

    Thanks Lou! Can’t wait to ski them…

  33. Ali E February 19th, 2009 8:39 am

    Hi again Lou

    Right, I’ve had a go at mounting my old Comfort bindings onto the the new Manaslus. I followed the guidance on the sticker and for my sole length of 320, used the foremost holes for the toe and the rearmost on the heel. I’ve only done one ski, but have come up against a problem, so thought I’d better seek advice

    Having adjusted for 6mm clearance between boot and binding at the heel, I find that the fore-aft adjustment for length is right at the end of its travel capability. Also, the plastic base of the binding doesn’t seem to sit completely flush with the ski… Just a fraction of a millimetre off on one of the screws, but there is some play. I’m wondering whether I should rescrew the heel into the other set of holes, where the length adjustment would be more centred and where I might get the base to sit better?

    If I do that, what should I do with the old holes? Should they be sealed in any way or are they OK as they are? Thanks for any advice!

    Ali

  34. Lou February 19th, 2009 11:23 am

    Ali, as long as you can adjust the bindings to 6 mm you’re fine. The plastic base of the binding should be flush on the ski, it sometimes gets held up because the screws thread into it, solution is to drill out the screw holes in the binding base plate so they’re slightly larger and don’t catch the screw threads as much. By slightly larger, I mean slightly. As far as the holes in the ski go, use whatever combination you feel like, and just put some tape over the ones you’re not using to keep water out.

  35. Mick McL March 29th, 2009 8:40 am

    Does anyone have the boot length versus binding position sticker that came with the 178 cm Manaslu information handy? Wondering which position to mount a pair of Scarpa Spirit 4 boots in boot length 305mm. Have heard the dynafit toe pins are 4 mm further back so that may skew it some… Thanks.

  36. Jeff P April 1st, 2009 4:51 pm

    Lou –

    I leave for a Euro ski mtneering adventure fri am, and am swapping some old comforts to new 178 Manaslus. I didn’t see this directly answered, so hopefully you can help; hopefully it’s not redundant. If I’m using the binding inserts (never mounted) should I use 1 hour epoxy, or lust a little punch in the top for the screw start and mount away? Thanks! Jeff

  37. Jason Gregg May 4th, 2009 7:35 pm

    I have the 178 Manaslu and a 315 boot sole. I just re-mounted using the forward hole for the toe. Mounting using the info that came with the skis put me too far back on the ski. Even if you have smaller feet than me I would try for the forward postion, just adjust the heel piece full forward and check that it reaches far enough to use the more forward mounting.

  38. Lou May 4th, 2009 7:44 pm

    Jeff, use something to seal the holes, Gorilla glue or some epoxy, doesn’t really matter. In a pinch you can just do it with no glue. Take care not to strip the screw holes.

  39. Steve Gorski September 12th, 2009 9:10 pm

    Mounted one Dynafit ST on the Manaslu. No problem. Started to mount the toe piece on the second ski and thought I’d get the screws started them back out and fit with the toe plate for a final mount. First screw I tried it on went in fine but when I tried to back it our the nylon insert spun with it !! Can’t get it out or in. Two threads showing, the rest are buried. Any ideas?

  40. Lou September 13th, 2009 4:11 pm

    Steve, sure, the ski should go back to dealer on warranty. ‘best, Lou

  41. SteveG September 14th, 2009 8:00 am

    Thanks for input Lou. I’ll try that approach first. The catch is that I bought them lightly used from a person who got them direct with the pro buy so no dealer involved. My mount is in previously unused hole locations. Plan B is to drill out the screw and then the insert and refit with a wood dowel. I’ve got the drill press in my shop and have done it before on many Nordic/Tele remounts. Since you’ve done surgery on this ski, what do you think of my plan? Thanks again for your time

  42. Lou September 14th, 2009 8:08 am

    Hi Steve, I think your plan will work. Personally, I’d do pretty much the same thing, only I’d fill with JB-Weld and steel wool. I don’t like the wood idea because it does funny things with moisture, but if it works for you then go for it. Only caveat would be to perhaps test whatever epoxy you use to make sure it doesn’t mess with the ski core materials. Perhaps pluck a tiny piece of foam out of the hole you bore, then drop it in a puddle of epoxy and see what happens.

  43. Jed Porter September 21st, 2009 2:03 pm

    Thanks for all the info here, just what this snow-jonesin’ gear-researcher needs!

    Just a clarification…

    Lou said: “As for mounting a Classic, just figure out where you want you boot to be on the ski, and position the binding accordingly.”

    Do I interpret/extrapolate this correctly: The Classic/Speed has enough adjustment built in (what is it, like 10mm or something?) and the holes on the 178 Manaslu are spaced close enough that I’d get a fit for Manaslu’s plus Classic/Speed plus small to mid-range boots (mondo 26 or so, 300-305 mm sole)?

    Built up as recommended, (Manaslu’s plus ST’s), they say 178′s work down to BSL 294) With Speed’s I’d probably use the sets of holes closest together and crank the heel piece as far forward as possible, right? Anyone willing to compare Speed heel pieces to ST heel pieces and tell me how much more forward the ST’s go? I only have Speed’s.

    I know I’m supposed to use FT’s or ST’s, cause they’re, like, more modern, and I know they have more length adjustment built in. But Speed’s are lighter and I have had no bad experiences with Speed/Classics.

  44. Lou September 23rd, 2009 6:03 pm
  45. Jonathan Shefftz September 23rd, 2009 7:55 pm

    Jed, a friend of mine lucked out using the Manaslu + TLT IV/Tech/Speed/Classic bindings. But I do mean lucked out: a slightly different BSL and he would have needed the longer adjustment range of the Comfort/Vertical.
    If you want, I can find out exactly what combo of ski length + bsl he had.

  46. Jed Porter September 29th, 2009 5:28 pm

    Thanks Lou and Jonathan both…
    Lacking any further info, I think I’ll have to go with the ST’s. The excellent photos on the linked adjustment range page indicate that the ST heel post does appear to go at least a little bit further forward (relative to the screw holes) than the Speed. But I suppose it’s possible that the heel piece itself has different proportions, including the different pin length. Anyway, thanks guys, great info. Jonathan, if it comes up in conversation, let me know what dimensions your friend had…

  47. Jonathan Shefftz September 29th, 2009 6:09 pm

    #s from my buddy:
    178cm ski + 320mm bsl boot + TLT IV/Tech/Speed/Classic bindings = success!
    Note that this was using the aft-biased holes for both toe and heel. (Would have also worked for the fore-biased holes for both toe and heel.)
    So, I just measured the hole spacing on a pair of 169cm Mustagh Ata Superlight – assuming that the hole spacing is identical on the Manaslu (hard to tell on my already mounted pair), then a 178cm Manaslu would also luck out with a 307mm bsl (toes mounted aft, heels mounted fore) and a 333mm bsl (toes mounted fore, heels mounted aft).
    But “real” bsl can vary among models for the same imprinted bsl, even more so with certain Scarpa models that have the Dynafit toe sockets set back. So these #s are valid only for boots whose bsl measuring methodology matches up exactly with the Garmont MegaRide/Dynamite/MegaLite . . . although with 6mm of fore/aft adjustment on the IV/Tech/Speed/Classic, there’s still a bit of leeway (although I don’t know in which direction, since I don’t know where exactly on the heel track his bindings are adjusted).
    BTW, note that a IV/Tech/Speed/Classic mounted in the center of its track will match up with exactly the same bsl for a Comfort/Vertical. In other words, the extra adjustment range of the latter is evenly distributed between fore/aft (and hence the mounting jig is the same).

  48. Jonathan Shefftz September 29th, 2009 9:15 pm

    and another datapoint (from another touring partner), just for future reference:
    169cm ski + 301mm bsl Dynafit TLT4, etc boot + TLT etc bindings = success (using aft-biased holes for both)
    So that means a 169cm ski and TLT etc bindings would also work for a 288mm and 314mm boot (based on Dynafit TLT4/Evo etc bsl measurement norms).

  49. Matt W November 15th, 2009 4:01 pm

    I bought some 169cm Manaslus last summer intending to transfer an old pair of dynafit bindings, although I’m not entirely sure which model, to my new skis. In addition I grabbed a new pair of the Garmont Radiums with a 305 bsl. Yet no matter what combination of the pre drilled holes I use on the Manaslus, I cant create a combination which fits the boot. Did Dynafit create a set up with a gap in compatible bsl, are the bindings too old (3 or 4 years), do I just screw it and drill my own holes, or am I just blind and missing something utterly obvious?
    Thanks for any help you can provide.

  50. Greg Louie November 15th, 2009 5:00 pm

    Matt, it’s not the age of the bindings, it’s the model. You probably have the original TLT Speed/Classic, which has a very limited adjustment range. Heel pieces from the Comfort, ST or FT lines will work.

  51. Lou November 15th, 2009 7:58 pm

    What Greg said.

    Drill new holes if you need ‘em, but I’d recommend a pair of Comfort or ST or FT.

  52. Steve H December 30th, 2009 11:13 pm

    Hi, I purchased a pair of Manaslu’s and wanted the Onyx G3 binding mounted on them…the shop I purchased at said no problem, but then said, “we haven’t done that yet.” I checked the Onyx mounting plates and the screw holes seem to line up, but wondered if anyone has used this setup or have any related feedback. I’m sking a 169 ski and BD Method skis.

    thanks
    steve

  53. Skian December 30th, 2009 11:37 pm

    You should have no problem mounting the Onyx on any Dynafit ski. The G3 pattern copied that of Dynafit.

  54. Lou December 31st, 2009 8:28 am

    Steve, what Skian said, the hole pattern is the same, though you do need to watch the position of your boot on the ski, as always when swapping bindings. To make that easier, the Onyx toe does have some for/aft position capability once it’s screwed to the ski, which is a nice feature.

    I mounted my first pair of test Onyx on skis already drilled for Dynafit and they worked fine.

  55. brendan madigan January 19th, 2010 8:57 pm

    i would strongly encourage everyone to use only the dynafit inserts only. after only 20 or so days my black diamond o1′s ripped completely out of the ski. and yes, these were mounted within the titanal plate. say what you want about a telemark binding on this ski, but a binding ripping out of the titanal plate is an obvious huge issue. dynafit says that any binding other than vertical st’s and ft12′s void the warranty of the ski. also, tlt speeds do not work on this ski. have fun – i didn’t doing the mo-ped for 7 miles out of the backcountry.

  56. skian January 19th, 2010 10:44 pm

    Brendan, you of all people should know that kind of mount is at own risk. You should of mounted a riser plate to the ski and used an old school cable to mount to that. Still at own risk but way more secure. However the binding in question (onyx) should have no issues with mounting. Hope you powder gluttons in Cali send us some snow in Colorado!

  57. Lou January 19th, 2010 11:13 pm

    NO WAY anyone should use telemark bindings on Dynafit skis. One reason Dynafit skis are lightweight is that they don’t have the massive binding reinforcement plates required by telemark bindings. That a tele binding ripped out is no surprise whatsoever, and there is no reason why they should warranty that. There are so so many great tele skis out there, why in the world mount a tele binding on a Dynafit ski?

    Also, to use the reliability of telemark binding screws as a comparison to an AT binding, secured at toe and heel, is simply not useful.

  58. brendan madigan January 19th, 2010 11:28 pm

    thanks ian, and no, we won’t be sending our feet upon feet of snow your way! why are you plugging the bonyx, are you rep-ing for them or something?

    what’s up with wanting to put a telemark binding on a dynafit ski? the manaslu is ripping fun, light, playful, etc. how could you not want it in your quiver?unfortunately lou, you are correct and they shouldn’t have been mounted. oh well, lesson learned. they sure were fun for the 20 or so days i skied them. there are an abundance of people that have mounted them tele with no problems, for the record. if they were savvy they’d make a beefier version with a reinforced binding plate. inserts alienate customers – they don’t make you buy dynafit bindings, they make you buy other skis. just my opinion though. if you are in the business of selling skis, you should do just that.

  59. Lou January 19th, 2010 11:36 pm

    I’d agree that inserts are not always an ideal sales tool. On the other hand, they work well for what they’re intended for, which is making the ski lighter and allowing one to mount a pair of Dynafit bindings in a fraction of the normal time.

    As for the great masses of telemark skiers using Dynafit skis, good for them. But I for one have been very happy there are skis available that don’t require me to carry around extra weight designed for telemark bindings. I hope that continues. And I suspect it will because the market for using Dynafit skis as telemark planks is utterly minuscule compared to their overall sales volume.

    P.S.,
    I noticed that the statement in the blog post above says “nearly any ski binding can be mounted on a Manaslu.” That’s pretty ambiguous and I should probably edit it or add a note to clarify.

  60. helga February 26th, 2010 7:31 pm

    I just purchased a Manaslu 178 and my boot size is 280. I weight 125 lb. My husband was thinking of using the predrilled holes for the toe binding and then drilling the heel piece. Are the words Made in Austria the boot centerline of the ski? If that is so, the center of the boot is 4-5cm forward of that. We don’t think that would make a big difference.

    If we mount the heel to the predrilled holes then the boot is closer to the center line, if Made in Austria is the center. We were thinking with my weight it may be better to be a little more forward on that ski so it would be a little more responsive.

    Thanks for your help!
    Helga

  61. Aaron Michalk March 15th, 2010 9:50 pm

    I got a pair of Vertical ST bindings and Mustagh Ata Superlight skis. The skis have the same mounting plate as the Manaslu. I mounted the bindings myself. It was pretty easy. I felt empowered.
    I didn’t use any adhesive and after several days of touring the screws started loosening up. I tightened them down again and after several more days of touring they are loose again.
    Has anyone else had this problem? I pulled the screws out in order to glue them with loctite blue, but I now see that there is no metal on the ski that will make contact with the screw. I guess I need to use “1 hour epoxy from the hardware store”, right? Is there any particular kind I should use? Or should I try using the loctite between the screw head and the metal part of the top of the toe binding?

  62. Jonathan March 16th, 2010 6:46 am

    Last year when I mounted my Manaslu setup, all 18 screws went in tight.
    This year, when I mounted my MA SL and another guy’s MA SL, one screw on each setup was a bit loose (so 2 out of 36) — but I stopped turning it before it really stripped. Since it was the most forward/center hole on the toe piece, I left it as is.
    Then I guy came to me with a Manaslu that had a real spinner. Tried fixing just using steel wool and epoxy, but didn’t seem sufficiently tight. In the process of removing and reinstalling that binding, yet another screw started spinning.
    The problem seemed to be that the screw when being installed cut into the plastic plug at first as intended, but then started to carve out the plastic, detaching a portion of the plastic and wrapping it around the screw.
    So I helicoiled both screws, and that went perfectly fine.
    If the integrity of the holes is still okay, then epoxy seems like it would keep the screws from backing out. But if some of the plastic plug has been removed by the screw, then relying on the epoxy makes me nervous…

  63. Jonathan March 16th, 2010 6:49 am

    Also, another guy had a different problem: the plastic plug became loose within the ski. He removed the plug entirely, replaced it with a wooden dowel, then we drilled into the dowel like we would normally drill into the ski.
    Overall, the inserts are convenient for someone who doesn’t have a jig, and they do save some time even if you have a jig, but the inserts definitely aren’t perfect.

  64. Lou March 16th, 2010 8:59 am

    I’ve had some spinners as well, and simply drilled out the plug and filled with mixture of JB-weld and steel wool. Took some time but just as good as anything. At this juncture, I’d say Dynafit needs to improve the inserts a bit, but no matter what they do eliminate the need for a mounting jig, and spinners are rare if you’re careful.

  65. MB March 23rd, 2010 10:38 pm

    I’ve just had a very interesting experience with the spinners on a new pair of Stokes. Having mounted a few of these insert skis, I knew of the careful attention required to keep them from stripping. On the initial mount, it had appeared to me that only 2 screws (both in toe pieces) had come close to stripping. Instead of forcing them tighter, I just left them slightly looser than the others…

    After 4 days of skiing, yesterday I noticed that my toe-lock lever was locking easier than normal when pulling into tour mode? A slight wiggle-test revealed a scary amount of play in the toe piece and on closer examination two very loose screws (not the ones originally loosish either!?). I removed the toe pieces a few hours ago and found that in all the stripped holes large, the black “threads” came out while removing the loose screws…

    After attempting a desperate repair (i’m out of town and working on skis tomorrow!) with epoxy, steel wool, and toothpicks I’ve managed slightly more bite in the stripped holes, but it looks like heli-coils are in my future… Maybe the JB weld fix instead??

  66. Lou March 24th, 2010 6:48 am

    MB, sorry to hear that. I’d recommend the JB-weld with a bit of steel wool method. Also, this validates my idea that even insert screws should be inserted with glue, I use epoxy. The glue lubes the screws as they go in so they don’t tear up the insert as much, and it locks them once it hardens.

    And, if you fill the stripped holes with JB, let it cure for a couple of days so it gets really hard before you drill the new hole, tap the hole, and insert the new screw with epoxy.

    Remember you’ll need to enlarge the hole a bit if you use the JB-weld method, and wallow it out a bit with an awl or something so it has a bit of an inverted pyramid shape so it holds the JB-weld plug super well. It also doesn’t hurt to use a veterinary syringe to inject the JB (available at any equestrian supply center). It might also work better to use the longer cure JB, not the JB-quick, as that gives the glue time to settle into the hole. Cure the glue in a warm place with the ski flat.

    Note that a known limit of the Dynafit inserts is they are designed to work with regular binding screws, which destroy a small amount of material each time they are run in an out of the insert hole. There is no set number on the number of times you can run the screws in and out, but using epoxy EACH time, and heating the screws before you take them out, seems to eliminate this problem so long as you’re gentle when you tighten and don’t spin a screw.

    I give props to Dynafit for sticking with their attempt at doing inserts, but perhaps the inserts need to be made with slightly stronger material, and perhaps tapped before the screw is inserted.

  67. MB March 24th, 2010 9:15 am

    Thanks Lou,

    It’s unfortunate that I’m losing confidence in the quality of the inserts using the recommended (by dynafit method). I’ve skied some really high consequence stuff on the inserts and have an incredible Europe itinerary lined up for April, where I’ll be on skis with inserts… It’s a bit of a shame to have to reinforce the inserts to be confident on the skis.

    Can you image a loose binding during your trip on Denali? a high altitude JB weld/steel wool fix!? Yikes!

    Do you think perhaps heliCoils might be a better option than the JB concoction?

  68. Matt May 6th, 2010 12:49 pm

    Just mounted the 187 Manaslu according the Dynafit specs for a Dynafit 317 boot. Really fell like I am skiing in the back seat and my center of boot is not center of ski. Should I move to the more forward screw holes? Thanks.

  69. Luke July 21st, 2010 11:36 am

    I am trying to mount Silvrett 500 on my 169cm Mustagh Ata (my first AT setup). Neptune is giving me fits. I am not an aggressive skier at all and I weigh about 140lb. How much trouble will I get into? Thanks for your advice.

  70. skian July 21st, 2010 12:09 pm

    Luke, Neptune is a great shop and is probably looking out for your best interest. Many people have mounted this setup and also tele to this ski. The issue is not you but the way the ski is constructed. You see in order to have the optimum performance from this light weight ski it is designed for the Dynafit binding. The plates and the support inserts are optimally placed for maximum strength with the Dynafit hole pattern. When you go outside of this pattern you compromise the strength of the system. I would pic one or the other either a different ski or binding. you also void all warranty if you drill outside of the insert pattern. Hope that helps

    Skian

    “get outside have some fun and enjoy the backcountry”

  71. Lou July 21st, 2010 12:22 pm

    Matt, it won’t hurt anything to try the other set of holes, so long as you’re careful.

    Luke, you do have to be super careful with using holes other than the ones provided by Dynafit for Dynafit. I’d say you might be able to get away with it, but I wouldn’t fault Neptune for being careful. They’ve probably seen it all before…

    The cool thing about Manaslu is that it’s incredibly light. But as Skian mentioned one reason for that is they leave out a lot of the stuff other companies put in to make a huge thick binding mounting plate. Many of us pray that Dynafit keeps doing what they are doing, and we’re pretty leery of folks mounting other brand/model bindings and then having durability problems that get reported on the web, look bad for Dynafit, and thus might cause Dynafit to quit making such as ski.

    So for a lot of reasons, be careful.

    Lou

  72. Luke July 21st, 2010 2:42 pm

    Thank you!!! Neptune will put helicoil and epoxy on as a way to make things a little better, though Dynafit doesn’t recommend helicoil. I am short on money (I own a few mountaineering boots all the way to Millet Everest) and time as I will leave this weekend for skiing at 17k elevation somewhere in Tibetan Plateau. So I just have to make do. The funny thing is there is at least one employee in Neptune has mounted tele on Dynafit.

  73. EricW November 2nd, 2010 4:49 pm

    Hey Lou,

    Two problems (one boneheaded second no fault of my own) if you’re still checking this page out…Other than my second problem I installed the bindings exactly as I was told from Dynafit, by hand.
    1) The bottom right screw on the toe piece went in about 2/3 of the way until it started spinning, some of the plastic eventually started threading out when I backed it out and tried to catch some more thread. It will not go in anymore, I called dynafit and they told me that I should just epoxy it and leave it as is, the lady said if the other screws are in all the way it wouldn’t matter, I’m inclined to say It does matter on my brand new expensive skis, what is your take on this, should I glue it and see what happens, seems to me all the screws should be set.

    2) I managed to mix up the stupid screws while drilling out the toe piece threads (as recommended by yourself and Dynafit) and put in three of the toe piece screws in the heel until I realized my blunder. I quickly removed them and replaced them with the correct screws. There are three small bumps in the bases now (very pissed at myself), but more importantly I may have compromised the four inserts. The screws seem to be holding well, would you recommend removing them and reinstalling with epoxy filling the rest of the hole? I’m afraid to take them out due my first problem..

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

  74. Lou November 2nd, 2010 5:01 pm

    If you popped the base, you need to gently drill with a small bit to near the Ptex, then inject epoxy and clamp the ski as a sandwich while you heat it up a bit so the epoxy drains in to the holes you drilled. After that, redrill then insert screws. Don’t redrill with too big a bit. It’s tricky but you can save the skis. I wouldn’t ski them till you reinforce with epoxy, as the Manaslu is not particularly beefy (one reason it is so nicely light in weight).

    As for the spinner, I don’t understand how the binding will function with a screw sticking part way out. Is that the situation? I fix spinner inserts by drilling out, filling with JB-weld and steel wool, then drilling out again, tapping, then gently inserting screw with epoxy. It’s a drag Dynafit still gets spinners on those skis. They’ve had how many years now to refine the manufacturing process?

    If it’s any consolation, I put the long screws in the rear of a mount I did just the other day, and rammed them home till I heard a POP of ski lamination letting go. Groan. My own skis and I’ll do the above epoxy trick just to be sure they don’t break underfoot.

  75. Skian November 2nd, 2010 6:28 pm

    Lou is the man! Exactly what I would do. I also have do this on the tailgate of the truck in to big a hurry to make turns. I lost it in the thread but do you have a superlight your doing this to?

  76. Skian November 2nd, 2010 6:32 pm

    Also what year is it? Lou you are assuming it’s new. New from a store or eBay is alot different than new from Dynafit. If it is truly a 2011 product I would like to see it. Lou has my digits.
    “get outside have some fun and enjoy the backcountry”

  77. EricW November 2nd, 2010 6:49 pm

    I’m new to this type of repair, so I hope you don’t mind some clarification. The long screws did not come all the way through the base, but they have created three small visible bubbles. If you still think I should be drilling and mending do you mean to drill from the top through the insert just shallow of the base and fill the entire hole, insert and all, with the epoxy, warm the base so it will fill in, let dry then drill a pilot hole and screw back into it? or am I missing it?

    I managed to get the spinner in most of the way before it “spun.” As a result I am able to lock into the binding without the screw getting in the way, but it is not driven flush with the binding.

    This has been a wonderful first dynafit experience! thanks for the help lou

  78. Lou November 2nd, 2010 6:54 pm

    Eric, you are correct. Clamp the ski in a sandwich made from some steel plates. You’ll probably still have some small bulges in the bottom, those will get taken out the first time you have the skis tuned.

    I’d drill out the spinner and do the JB-weld thing…

    Skian, good point, who knows what year those things are!

    Eric, you got a serial number? We’re curious.

    BTW, on some skis when the base gets popped, I’ll go ahead and just drill right through the ski, then fill with epoxy during the process, then I’ll skive some of the epoxy out and drip in some Ptext when everything is done. I do that to make sure the epoxy doesn’t get air spaces in it.

  79. EricW November 2nd, 2010 7:12 pm

    Bought them this year at a local shop here in jackson hole brand new, assuming they are this years, number on the sidewall is 0904023, or is the serial around midpoint above “made in austria,” that number’s 811706.
    Any recommendations on type of epoxy, the screws should thread into a small pilot hole in the epoxy pretty easily?

    With the spinner, do you drill out a hole about the screw length about as big as the insert? Also are you talking a full on tap job, or just small pilot hole as you advised in the epoxy?

  80. EricW November 2nd, 2010 7:29 pm

    Is it a bad idea to insert screw in JB weld steel wool mix before it drys and let them bond together, or gradually screw as it dries? Trying to weigh all the options…

  81. Skian November 2nd, 2010 10:08 pm

    Eric, Lou has you on the right path. I still would like clarification on the ski. Manaslu? Mustagh Ata?
    As for inserts we have had a few running changes over the years on this ski with inserts. 100% pull it plug it and seat the screw. I prefer heili coils. Although I also love anything with the word wool in it!
    As for the dimples IMO if it’s a slight press better to get a cheap pease of round stock just a little bigger than the size of the dimple. Heat the base carefully with a blow dryer or heat gun and hit it down as much to flush as possible. The problem with leaving them for the stone grinder is that base material is only a few mills thick. The grinder will smooth it but then the thinning of the ptex will compromise the integrity of the area a a warm day and a rock can rip a good scare in it.
    Sorry you having so much trouble I guess that is why we pay shops for the hassle. 20 years ago I used to always have I ski mount I botched every year usually in the first 20. The dimples should not be a game changer but you do want to seat that screw. I always use a lot of down force when starting screws just as a habit, and as that great super knowledgeable tech girl at Dynafit said! ” never use a gun” now get those things mounted up because I’m going to steal your line on the pass!

  82. Lou November 3rd, 2010 6:48 am

    Eric, never ever glue a screw in with something like JB, it is too strong. You want to fill the hole with something strong, like JB, then drill it for the screw and insert screw with regular epoxy. The procedure is several steps over the space of 24 hours or so, so the JB has time to cure. For filling and re-drilling use regular JB, not JB Kwik, and cure in a warm place overnight.

    You might consider practicing all this stuff on a dumpster ski. It is scaring me, thinking you’re learning how to do this on a new pair of expensive boards.

  83. Lou November 3rd, 2010 6:57 am

    Skian, I indeed “tap” the dimples back in sometimes, but hesitated to mention that to someone new to the game, as it requires some judgment and experience to know how much to beat on them. Clamping and heating with epoxy in there has some of the same effect if you use a nice stiff clamping pad or put a scraper over the dimples and the clamp feet directly over them. But even doing that can crush a ski such as Manaslu.

    As for ski shops, we’ve actually had more people chime in here about messed up shop mounts than home mounts. Not sure if that is statistically valid, but interesting nonetheless…

    Once upon a time, an industry big-wig tried to warn me off from providing DIY
    binding mounting instructions, with all sorts of dire lecturing about liability and lawsuits. I spoke with a few attorneys after that and they said I had little to worry about so long as we published a disclaimer and didn’t commit gross negligence. And after I heard about dozens of shop mess-ups, I worried even less. But human error is always a factor. It’s pretty much a given that ski mounting messes will happen, at home or in the ski shop…

  84. Skian November 3rd, 2010 7:58 am

    Lou, agreed on the education. But I would have to say this. If a shop botches it it is taken care of by the shop. History is something we learn from. We are in a much different situation than when Wild snow first began. We have a much more informed dealer base that is better educated on how to mount this tool. The level of knowledge in a Pro shop that is an authorised dealer is far greater than that of a shop that does not sell the catagory. Sometimes trying to save a few bucks creates a nightmare.
    I am a milk circle guy. I buy local and search out the pro shop not the cheap bro shop. I pay a pro who has invested his life in the game. He takes that money and buys milk from the local dairy and it stays in the local community..
    If we all buy everything on the net we will have no shops to tell our stories in. I know of several pro shops in Jackson. Aspen, Breck Mammoth, North Bend… the list goes on.
    This blog is one of the greatest open forum resources on the web for this product. That’s why I am here. Because you and your crew call it straight. Maybe we should start calling out local pro shops from around the country and quit looking at then as the bad guys. Sorry but some people should just support your local retailer and get outside have some fun and enjoy the backcountry.
    Cheers Ian

  85. Lou November 3rd, 2010 9:35 am

    Skian, I’d agree that if you do know for certain of a pro ski mech it’s often good to use them! But seriously, it is really tough for the average consumer to find those guys.

    I and the folks here don’t look at pro shops as the bad guys. We’re just realistic.

  86. EricW November 3rd, 2010 10:53 am

    Thanks Guys,
    My shiny new boards with self inflicted wounds are indeed 178 manaslu’s. The funny, or rather sad part is I bought both bindings and skis from a local shop and could have had them mounted for free (it’s hard to admit). I’m a fairly handy guy, by no means a shop genius, but the insert system seemed so straight forward I couldn’t help doing it myself. Simple things can sure be humbling.

    Lou, I have to laugh that you’re scared for me, imagine how I feel haha, this is not the ideal way to learn, but my backs against the wall. I have a few pairs of old ski’s lying around, so I will do a few trial runs before I try it on my poor skis. You guys have been beyond helpful, I’m sure I’ll have another question or two as I get my hands dirty. Here goes nothing.

  87. Lou November 3rd, 2010 10:56 am

    Yeah! Do it on the old skis first!

    Thanks for being honest Eric, you get a lot more help that way. And remember many of us have made similar mistakes.

    Lou

  88. Skian November 3rd, 2010 11:13 am

    Eric, ditto me two. I’ve botched more mounts than I have digits on my hand… But I’d never admit that in a public forum…. Oh wait a minute.
    Also just for a point of clarification we never put inserts in skis so anyone could mount their own boards.
    The Dynafit ski is a unique tool. Designed for the up down and all around. Inserts are there because we can create the best lightest performance skis in the market. It’s very easy to make a 2000 gram ski perform well downhill. It’s very difficult to do that with a 1600 gr. Ski….
    Oops better get those skis fixed just looks like I poached another one of your lines.

  89. SteveG November 3rd, 2010 4:54 pm

    I bought my 178 Manaslu’s as a used ski last year (August of 09) so I’m pretty sure they are from the 08/09 run. And yes, I botched two of the mounting holes. One stripped, my bad, and one spun, my bad(?) Interesting side note is that while waiting for my skis to be delivered, the seller said he was having “a problem” removing one of the screws, Selewa was very accommodating and offered to sell me one ski at a very good discount but I managed a DIY , non- helicoil, repair.

    Quote from Skian- “As for inserts we have had a few running changes over the years on this ski with inserts.”

    I’d be very interested to know what changes/improvements were made.

  90. EricW November 4th, 2010 6:23 pm

    What order of operations shall I use on my dimples? Should I fill the holes with epoxy, clamp and let dry so the glue gets in any exposed damaged areas, then try the warming and tapping of bases or vise versa?

  91. Jonathan Shefftz November 4th, 2010 6:32 pm

    Just how bad are the dimples? I’ve had two cases of dimpling:
    – Atomic R:9.22 I bought at an REI “garage” sale for almost nothing, brand new other than the drilled holes and consequent dimples.
    – Volkl G1 20/20 (identical to the backcountry “Outback” model of its day), which I bought in such a diminutive size that I started to dimple the Diamir hold down screws (since they’re so far back and the ski is so thin there) before I realized what I was doing (and removed the screws, then filed them down a bit).
    For both pairs of skis, I did absolutely nothing to address the dimpling, and they held up fine.

    BTW, re Dynafit inserts, on 2008-09 and 2009-10 models (Manaslu, MA SL, 7 Summits SL), I’ve experienced on about six pair (both my own skis and others) a higher rate of spinners than when I mount Dynafits with my jig. Fortunately the stripped hole takes a heli coil just fine, so it’s just a minor inconvenience if you have a well-equipped work room or ski shop. If you’re trying to do it on your own though with just a pozidrive and nothing else, a typical shop will charge only $10 or so per helicoil.

  92. Lou November 4th, 2010 6:41 pm

    Eric, if you’re going to tap the bases in as well as drill and epoxy, drill first, then warm and tap, then epoxy in, then clamp. Personally, I’d skip the hammering if I was going to the extent of drill and epoxy and clamping.

    Jonathan is right, if the dimpling is minor, you can just ignore or just tap them in a bit, mount your bindings, then go enjoy some pow.

  93. Skian November 4th, 2010 10:08 pm

    Agree with Jonathon, if the dimple are not bad let them go. If not try heat follow the thread down to were I talked about it. Also if they are not too high take a rasp file to them and lower them to level. Hard to plag arm chair AB without a visual. This might be a good how too for Lou and crew to do on wild snow. It already might be here but I don’t know. this type of thing happens every day in ski shops ( dimpling bases ghat is) and is a fairly common practice in ski shops with alpine tele etc…it’s always worth grabbing some dumpster skis and doi g it on purpose. Drill it dimple it with a long screw and play away. My dad said if you don’t fall your Not trying hard enough. Of course at 45 it just hurts more. With 500 dollar skis you might need something to deaden the pain. Good luck

  94. EricW November 8th, 2010 8:51 pm

    Guru’s,

    Practicing on my beaters with success but some more questions of course…

    On the dimpled heels, how far down should I drill? I know you stated just before the ptex, but I’m assuming the long screws that caused the dimples probably reached that point already. Won’t I be drilling into the ptex immediately? Anything wrong with just filling the insert with epoxy, clamping until it dries, then drilling and screwing?

    Also, with the JB business on the spinner, after drilling,filling the hole with JB/Steel wool and drying how small of a hole should I drill for the screw, I’m going to try a few sizes on the dumpster ski, but is there a general screw to hole ratio I should follow?

    thanks, again, and again

  95. EricW November 8th, 2010 9:04 pm

    Oh and how big of a hole do you make when you drill out the spinner for the JB, I have a few different sizes setting up on the practice ski…

  96. Skian November 8th, 2010 10:26 pm

    Eric, k tapping this out on the iPhone so unlike my wife…biz partner and biz partners mom don’t give me grief for miss spelling something here or lack of punctuation.
    Lou has great beta on this on the site. Good job on the betters and yes with the JB weld fill it let it dry and I tap it for good thread purchase. If you just screw it you crush the wood break the fibers and will also crush the isocore. This creates in my opinion a week bond. Your ptex base is about 3 to 4 mil think so you don’t want to go too deep I take a drill bit and rap tap over it to about 3 or 4 from the bottom. Just hold the bit up to the side mark and tape. Good job on the fortuitiveness on the project. It’s all trial and error dude. Stick with it and pass on the info and get your buddies on Wild Snow.
    Cheers Skian

  97. Lou November 9th, 2010 7:05 am

    Eric, just big enough to get most of the plug out and a little extra, but don’t go wild or you’ll end up with a huge hole. Since even JB might not adhere that well to the plug material left in the hole, after the main hole is drilled you might want to take a small drill bit and drill a few 1/32 inch deep holes sideways in the larger hole, to anchor the JB.

    Remember, as Skian pointed out, you will drill and tap a regular binding screw hole in the JB after it has hardened. Mix a bit of steel wool in the JB, but not too much, it’s pretty strong stuff as is once it has cured.

    Do the JB in a warm environment so it flows well and cures quickly overnight. Temperature makes a huge difference with the stuff.

    If the plug was just stripped and the SCREW is all that spins, you’d just drill out the plug threads and a little extra. But I’m assuming the PLUG is what is spinning?

  98. Lou November 9th, 2010 7:09 am

    As for the rear dimples, you’d just drill with a small bit down through the insert a bit, assuming you can get in there and drill without wrecking the insert threads and thus ending up even worse off. Like Skian said, you might be able to just bang/tap in the dimples, and I’d add that you should at least combine that with epoxy and clamping. It’s a judgment call. I’d have to have the skis here to know for sure. You are up against the limit of how much valid DIY advice we can really give you.

  99. SteveG November 9th, 2010 7:45 am

    In repairing the spinning plug in my Manaslu, I was able to just cut back the clear top coat to the the size of the hole in the metal top sheet with an Xacto knife. Then I inserted a screw and used a claw hammer to remove it like I would take out a nail. No drill needed.

  100. Jonathan Shefftz November 9th, 2010 7:50 am

    So let’s say the binding were to be repositioned such that some of the previously used holes were now exposed to the elements? Not worry about it? (since the nylon plug is forming a barrier against moisture seeping into the ski core) Or seal up (either with standard plastic plug or JB Weld) as per standard practice with previously used on regular skis?

  101. Lou November 9th, 2010 8:02 am

    Steve, good point. I hadn’t thought about it but if the spinning plug is spinning totally free it would be tough to drill! I fixed one a while ago that spun but still had enough resistance for a drill… but if it had started spinning super easy then yanking it out would have been good, though I’d be concerned with damaging the ski while yanking the thing out.

  102. Lou November 9th, 2010 8:19 am

    Jonathan, I’d seal the holes just because water getting in there and freezing could crack the plug and do something weird to the ski core…

  103. Jonathan Shefftz November 9th, 2010 8:20 am

    Thanks — forgot about that pesky frozen water expansion!
    So just daub in some JB Weld?

  104. Lou November 9th, 2010 8:25 am

    I’d probably use some 5min epoxy if I wanted it permanent, but I tend to just put little squares of duct tape over the holes if I’m messing around and might use the holes again.

  105. Jonathan Shefftz November 9th, 2010 8:42 am

    Why not JB Weld? Wouldn’t that be more secure than duct tape, but allow the hole to be reused unlike epoxy?

  106. Lou November 9th, 2010 9:19 am

    Jonathan, sure, JB would be fine, I was just thinking out loud. Let’s just remind people to NEVER use something like JB to glue a screw in, as it’s difficult to reverse compared to heat sensitive hardware store grade epoxy.

  107. scree November 9th, 2010 10:01 am

    Jonathan Shefftz said:
    “Why not JB Weld? Wouldn’t that be more secure than duct tape, but allow the hole to be reused unlike epoxy?”

    Could a dab of silicone be used instead?

  108. Lou November 9th, 2010 10:11 am

    Scree, I’ve used “silly” but it wrecks any future glue bonds so I tend not to use it much on skis. I do use it for one trick, I squirt a blob under the hollow parts of the Dynafit toe plastic base plate to make it stronger, or so my theory goes…

  109. SteveG November 9th, 2010 11:48 am

    Lou,

    Re: Claw hammer insert extraction –
    SOP for me but others may need guidance. When yanking something out with a claw hammer, place a piece of wood under the lever point to pull at a 90 deg. angle.

    PS – Is there a way to insert pics in the reply? I document in pictures what I do.

  110. Lou November 9th, 2010 12:41 pm

    Steve, you can email me the photos and I’ll publish if appropriate, can’t insert in post comments. See contact link in nav menu for email addy.

    If you do send pics, please send ones that are 525 pixels wide if possible, that way I don’t have to re-process.

    Lou

  111. Andy November 22nd, 2010 4:11 pm

    I just helped a friend install some FT 12 bindings on 187 Manaslus for 29.5 Maestrale boots. The installation was quick and easy using the foreward toe unit holes and the rearward heel unit holes, as per the recommendation sticker on the ski. The heel units only had to be adjusted forward a few millimeters to fit the boot. Also, all the inserts were good, no spinners.

    One issue was encountered with the FT 12 heel units when mounted w/o the brakes. Both heel units wobbled a bit, even with the DIN adjusted. I took off one of the heel units, checked to make sure the bushing was in all the way, the springs and washer were in, the cap was threaded correctly, etc. Nothing appeared off, but the heel unit still wobbled a bit. With the boot locked in, the wobble wasn’t as noticeable, but it was still there. I offered to put the brakes back on and see what effect that would have, but it was getting late and my friend didn’t want the brakes on. Any comments?

  112. Lou November 22nd, 2010 4:22 pm

    Andy, I’d have to see how much wobble. It’s impossible to have a material to material connection that small without a certain perceptible degree of movement. But with the FT and ST bindings it’s not very much. Did you compare to other Dynafits? To alpine bindings?

    Let me know.

  113. Andy November 22nd, 2010 4:29 pm

    Yes, I compared to a pair of mounted Classics and to a pair of mounted STs with brakes. There was a very slight movement in the Classic heel unit, but not as much in the FT 12 heel units in question. The STs with brakes had no noticeable wobble.

  114. Lou November 22nd, 2010 4:41 pm

    Can’t compare with brakes, as they add support via the brake retainer clip. But if they are moving more than a Classic then I’d be wondering, but like I said I’d have to see them before I can make a call. I just checked the one pair of STs we have mounted without brakes, and they do have a tiny bit of play, but nothing I’d be concerned with whatsoever (less than an alpine binding).

    I don’t know if Dynafit still provides them, but for a while they used a small circular teflon shim that was placed inside the rear housing above the spindle, to eliminate some of the type of play you describe. I have no idea if customer service at Salewa NA even knows what I’m talking about, but if they do perhaps it’s worth playing around with these, or just making some out of super thin plastic. They only work if you have a LOT of play. Otherwise they jam things up.

    Perhaps you should take your skis to one of the Competency Centers that Skian describes. That way you could ask a tech about your concern. Like I said, I’d have to see the binding to know if they were out of spec or not.

    Mainly, I wouldn’t be too concerned unless it’s more play than an alpine binding.

  115. Jonathan Shefftz November 22nd, 2010 5:12 pm

    Sure the plastic heel plates are really screwed down all the way so that they’re completely flush up against the ski topskin? Helps to look at the ski in cross section up against a light to check for any gap, which is consistent with the wobble you’re observing.

  116. Lou November 22nd, 2010 5:15 pm

    Jonathan, good point!

    Along those same lines, I’ve seen quite a few bindings with play caused by the rear spindle base wallowing a depression in to the ski topskin. That wouldn’t be the case with these new skis, but is something to watch for with old.

  117. Andy November 22nd, 2010 5:48 pm

    Thanks for the input. We did check that the heel plates were flush against the top sheet, but we were also being careful not to overdrive the screws and potentially strip the inserts — so that will be worthwhile to recheck.

  118. SteveG November 22nd, 2010 5:57 pm

    Andy – I had the same wobble issue twice. Once on a Comfort / Shuksan and again on a Comfort / Manaslu mount that was compounded by my reluctance to over tighten. Fixed it with a small piece of duct type on top of the ski under the heel spindle. I used two layers as I recall.

  119. Aaron November 22nd, 2010 6:03 pm

    I mounted STs on Mustagh Ata Superlights. I screwed in the screws to what I judged to be hand tight. Both the heel and toe units still had a little play. I determined that the cause of the play was due to the fact that the screw head wasn’t holding the binding tight enough to the ski. I timidly screwed the screws a little tighter and the heel and toe units stopped wiggling. However I stripped one of the toe unit screws.

  120. Lou November 22nd, 2010 6:23 pm

    Meanwhile, Skian is getting chills, thinking, hey, you guys need to take those things to the ski shop! He might be right, but keep trying. Indeed, if you have any doubt about the heel unit being tight enough to the ski, that’s the first thing to check! Super important. Dynafit is the only binding known to use the ski directly as part of the binding.

  121. skian November 22nd, 2010 7:07 pm

    Ahh Lou?? Why do you have to throw stones :). I’m enjoying margs over sunset in Austin and my Dawson radar goes off?? Sometimes what happens is in order to get the retention on the inserts unknowledgeable first timers don’t want to seat the screws too hard for fear of stripping out the threads(smart Idea). Sometimes the glue used in holding the inserts in can pool in the bottom of the insert cavity in the wood core and become hard. This in turn can create a false bottom and from a torque feel, the resistance will become hard. An amateur will stop to avoid stripping as they should. At this point, put down the beer or other round vessel and take it to a Competence Center or Pro shop to fix it.
    Okay. In all seriousness, even though Dynafit skis have inserts I always take a jig or template with a 3.5×9.0 and shoot the insert to clear the well. This will alleviate the false bottom feel and allow you to seat the plate on top sheet which is an integral part of the boot binding ski integration. Maybe Lou can recommend a pep boys to borrow an air hammer or something.
    If you have not stripped it, you might be able to remove the binder carefully, drill the hole without kissing the threads and bottom the hole. I would, as Lou suggested, take it to a shop of quality. Without pics or any physical product in front of me, I will not make any suggestions. This is nothing but the rant of a stubborn Scotsman currently downing margs in Texas. Take it for what it’s worth.
    Someone get outside have some fun and enjoy the backcountry!

  122. Lou November 22nd, 2010 7:21 pm

    I got the air tool going, and it shattered my glass house! (grin)

    At any rate, Skian, excellent tip about the insert holes possibly getting blocked up. I think I had that happen once when I got a spinner. Must be instinct, but now when I mount Dynafit inserts I always punch down with a skinny sharp pick to make sure there is a complete channel for the screw that’s not too short or weird feeling.

  123. Skian November 22nd, 2010 8:49 pm

    Lou, the punch only pushes the top film. I personally still recommend shooting. The insert glue bricks and crystalizes hard enveloping the insert surrounded by wood and Isocore.. If you do see seepage into the main insert wall this can create a hard surface under the film. Sometimes this can be seen from the surface and if you try to punch it with an awl it hits hard. This is not a defect it is from the intense presure in forming the cap and getting the glue to bond the inserts in. I know when I was at K2 and we did the first inserts for tele skis our focus was to alleviate drilling and increase retention due to the forces of the new plastic boots. . This is not the focus for Dynafit inserts. The focus is retention while using a plate with a light weight core specifically for the binding. This is one reason Dynafit skis are so light. This is why i shoot the inserts but do not use a 4.1 i use a 3.5 and a tap. Think formula one. Design specific. Again rants of a Scotsman!
    I am the only one responsible for what I say.
    Now back to Harry Potter and the kids.

  124. SteveG November 22nd, 2010 9:57 pm

    Glad to finally hear a knowledgeable “Why to – How To”. That tip would have saved me. For some of us, the nearest shop with Dynafit capability is an 8 hour round trip. Not everyone wants to game the system. Dynafit needs a Wiki.

  125. F Porter November 24th, 2010 11:58 pm

    Thanks for another informative post!
    The mounting location sticker mentions ZZero and ZZeus.
    What would be recommended for the TLT 5 boot? My binding will be a Comfort and my primary boot the TLT 5 will be the shortest BSL i’d use at 307mm in sz 28. My now backup Megarides have a BSL of 320mm. The 26mm range of the Comfort heel piece should cover the sole length difference. But which toe location should I use?
    thanks,
    Fred

  126. SteveG November 25th, 2010 11:29 am

    With my 28 (320 BSL) MegaRide’s on 178 Manaslu I mounted Comfort’s using the forward holes on both toe and heel. Heel adjustment came out about in the middle. Not sure if that works for your 307 BSL. Lay it out and eyeball it first is what I would do.

  127. F Porter November 29th, 2010 12:18 am

    Hi Steve, Thanks. The sticker says aft-fwd mount will accommodate 294-318mm. The two toe mounts are 13mm apart. So using fwd-fwd will move range to 307-331. Which should _just_ fit the TLT 5 and easily (as you describe) the Megaride.

  128. SteveG November 29th, 2010 8:57 am

    Since it’s a close call with your 307 BSL, you might want to try tracing a paper template from the skis and mounting on a board first for a test run. You’ll be able to then measure the boot heel / binding heel unit gap to make sure it is within the specs. I recall reading that not all boot makers mount the toe fitting in the same place and the real mechanical issue is the distance between the fittings rather than the BSL.

    I chose the forward/forward position after hearing that early testers felt that it skied better than the aft/aft setup. Mine are 3 years old though and Dynafit may have changed the location. How do they ski? Well my ability is such that the right “ski for me” is one that has a slippery bottom and is turned up at the front (struggling intermediate)

    I consider myself a Manaslu “expert” as defined by a quote by the physicist Neils Bohr. “An expert is someone who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field” :wink:

  129. EricW December 8th, 2010 10:24 am

    Thank you lou and skian for all your great advice on my botched mounting job. My skis and I really appreciate it. Everything seems to be holding, so far so good. You have a great website, keep up the good work.

  130. mt surf December 13th, 2010 9:40 am

    Hi Lou,

    I recently mounted a pair of Vertical ST’s on some 187 Manaslus, but unfortunately still have a thin gap between both toepieces and the topsheets. (using a #3 screwdriver, good and hand tight). Any advice for getting the binding to suck closer and seal flush with the ski? (also tried backing them out and re-screwing)
    Thanks a bunch.

  131. Lou December 13th, 2010 9:44 am

    Surf, we’ve covered this issue before but it’s probably tough to find. Three things. FIRST, make sure the insert is not blocked by resin inside the insert bore. Second, make sure your binding holes in the ski don’t have a rim that’s holding the binding plate up off the ski. Third, drill out the holes in the plastic binding plate so they fit the screws snug, but the screw barely thread in them. That way the screws won’t “double thread” as you try to tighten. Could be one or both of these things is causing your problem. If you’re re-inserting binding screws, be careful not to strip, and use epoxy.

  132. mt surf December 13th, 2010 9:48 am

    Much obliged Lou. You’re the man!

  133. Lou December 13th, 2010 9:51 am

    Surf, here is the post about inserts being blocked by resin:

    http://www.wildsnow.com/3927/insert-dynafit-blocked/

    I’ll add to our index and FAQ, thanks for reminding me about that.

    Lou

  134. terry December 15th, 2010 10:46 pm

    I’m having G3 Targas mounted on Manaslus 178s. The shop balked at first (by phone) but then said the bindings should match the prepunched plate holes. Should I be worried? Any advice appreciated. Terry

  135. Skian December 16th, 2010 1:10 am

    Depends on how big you are. I have lots of bros that have had success but you do void your warranty.

  136. terry December 16th, 2010 5:06 am

    Thanks. 5’10″; 165 lbs; x-mountain cartridge. I gather I shouldn’t expect the Manaslus to last as long as my ~2000 Total Pistes.

  137. Lou December 16th, 2010 9:17 am

    Terry, frankly, I just don’t see the reason for doing something with a ski as expensive and carefully designed as Manaslu that’s probably going to destroy it. There are so many choices of wide light skis out there that have massive binding plates, why not use one of those? Sure, Manaslu is a great lightweight powder ski designed for fixed heel skiing, why does that make it compelling for telemark above and beyond dozens of other choices? Pray tell.

  138. terry December 16th, 2010 2:53 pm

    Hey Lou. I’d like to replace my old Totally Piste with something wider and light. A good friend of mine told me his son has the set up and recommended it. Didn’t give it much more thought than that. Skian’s pals don’t seem to be okay with it. Your post, and the email below from Dynafit, give me pause. I’m all ears if you have a personal recommendation for an alternative. Thanks. T

    On Dec 16, 2010, at 10:10 AM, Sarah Anawalt wrote:

    Hi Terry,

    We do not recommend mounting telemark bindings on our skis that have pre-drilled inserts. The tele bindings put too much torque on the toe unit and will not hold as it should. That being said, if you choose to go forward with it anyways, please note the warranty will be voided on the ski.

    Thanks,
    Sarah

    Sarah Anawalt
    Senior Customer Service Representative
    Sarah.Anawalt@Salewa.com

    P: 303-444-0446 x112
    F: 303-496-0252
    4730 Walnut Street, Suite #200
    Boulder, CO 80301

  139. Lou December 16th, 2010 3:10 pm

    K2 Coomback, Black Diamond Justice or Drift, lots of options out there.

  140. Eurob December 30th, 2010 4:16 pm

    Hello,

    i’d like to have a used manaslu I got cheaply with a Dynafit Vertical Lite I got around. The Vertical Lite heel has the same pattern as the TLT Speed (and zero adjustment range when mounted), so the inserts don’t fit and I need to drill in between. The problem is pretty much all of the inserts are already used, and I will end up drilling really close to them, like 5mm. The screw might even be partly in the wood core and partly in the insert material.

    How are the chances this will work out if I fill the inserts properly before mounting? Epoxy+steel wool has been mentioned. Or is that too risky? I am not super hard on my gear.

    Manaslu+Vertical lite would be a match made in heaven, I’d really like to get this done.

    Thanks

  141. ToddL February 3rd, 2011 5:52 pm

    Can someone tell me the drill bit size for a binding screw helicoil. Long story, but I have all of the parts and tools except for the special bit that comes with the kit. I read one place that it may be 5.8mm, but I want to make sure, and the Heli-Coil site and catalog don’t seem to reference it for the 12AB screw. There is a mention of helicoils on this post, so I hope asking the question here is Okay. Thanks!

  142. AKjeff March 1st, 2011 3:30 pm

    Note on boot length and Dynafit mounting holes. Just mounted my F12s on a pair of 182 Stokes only to find out the closest holes were too far apart for my 297mm Spirit 4s. The sticker on the skis indicates the closest holes will accommodate down to a 294, but that is for Dynafit boots. Scarpa places the front inserts 4 mm backward of Dynafit or they are measuring from different locations. A little frustrating to mount and epoxy bindings in place and now have to put another set of holes in my new skis.

  143. Robin August 10th, 2011 1:19 am

    I have mounted http://www.quiverkiller.com/ in my pair of Manaslu. If I’m remembering correct the dynafit plastic insert was 12mm in diameter and the drill bit for the quiverkiller was 9mm.

    So it wasn’t any problem to drill out the plastic insert and screw in the metallic one from quiverkiller.

    This meas that i now can swap my F12 between my Manaslu and Sidestash in matter of minutes.

  144. Lou August 10th, 2011 6:59 am

    AK and everyone, ALWAYS before drilling skis for tech bindings, place the boot and bindings on the ski as if they were mounted, and do a visual check on how everything fits. Takes two or three minutes and can avoid some real head scratches later on. And yes, some Scarpa boots have the toe inserts installed 4 mm rearward. This is actually a very good thing as it makes for a more efficient stride and eliminates need for duckbill toe, but it does glitch some binding mounts unless you’re careful.

    Robin, when I strip a Dynafit factory insert I just fire in a Quverkiller. They seem to work fine in the Dynafit inserts. When installing Quiverkiller in the Dynafit ski I use the type of epoxy that’s enabled for plastic.

  145. Jonathan Shefftz August 10th, 2011 7:03 am

    “And yes, some Scarpa boots have the toe inserts installed 4 mm rearward. This is actually a very good thing as it makes for a more efficient stride and eliminates need for duckbill toe, but it does glitch some binding mounts unless you’re careful.”
    – This reminds me of one of the few positive things I can say about G3′s entry in the “Tech” binding market: their mounting jig uses not the same recycled alpine downhill toe rest, but instead a set of pincers. Dynafit should do the same with its jig. (Plum takes a different approach entirely with its jig, locating the heel unit holes only after the toe has been mounted.) Even aside from Scarpa, the precise offset of the toe sockets (relative to the boot lug) can vary considerably. Not that big a deal for 26mm Vertical track, but pretty important for the 6mm Speed, plus why not get it right with the jig anyway?

  146. Lou August 10th, 2011 7:50 am

    Jonathan, I’d agree. But it is a simple matter to shift the Dynafit jig a bit during a mount, though time is time and we all don’t have enough of it…

  147. Jonathan Shefftz August 10th, 2011 8:13 am

    If the goal is to mount the heel piece so that it’s exactly centered in the track, I don’t think it’s a simple matter of shifting the jig. You have to know the extent to which the boot’s toe socket offset varies from whatever the “standard” is on which the jig was constructed.
    A Tech jig ideally needs to have a set of pincers to determine the toe holes location relative to the heel holes, and then also boot center indicator that is based upon the distance between the ends of toe and heel lugs. (Or of course you can skip that and use BoF.) Or just take the Plum approach and have a jig designed to mount the holes in sequence, so that once the toe is mounted and the ski boot inserted, the jig then backs up against the end of the heel.

  148. Lou August 10th, 2011 10:14 am

    Jonathan, you might be overthinking this.

    What I do to be sure is following (I don’t always go to this extent, but when I want things really dialed here is the sequence.:

    Stick binding toe on boot, set boot/binding on ski, make mark on ski in one of the binding toe screw holes. Remove boot/binding, stick jig on ski and line up drill hole in jig with mark on ski, drill toe. That takes care of perfectly locating the binding toe.

    Screw binding toe on ski with one or two screws, not tight.

    Stick boot in binding toe on ski.

    Next, set binding heel to mid-range of for/aft adjustment, or compromise one way or the other if larger or smaller boot is suspected in the future. Put binding heel on ski, insert pins in boot heel and set boot/binding heel gap. Mark one or two of the binding heel screw holes. Remove boot/binding from ski and place jig back on ski. Line up jig with heel hole mark/s and drill.

    Screw binding heel and toe on ski, starting with heel, using usual alignment procedures of shifting toe slightly while inserting screws.

    We’ve done a couple hundred mounts this way and never had any problems other than user error.

    Yeah, the jig could be better and as you say use pins in to to locate. The original Dynafit jigs did that. But above works and is a nice sequence that eliminates doubt.

    Lou

  149. Jonathan Shefftz August 10th, 2011 10:49 am

    Accurate, yes, but that requires installing and then removing two toe unit screws per ski, which I’d rather avoid.

  150. Lou August 10th, 2011 11:10 am

    It works, that’s all I can say, and it even works with just one screw lightly holding the toe on the ski…

  151. rob mainwaring September 24th, 2011 9:06 am

    Lou,

    You mention the following above:

    “Robin, when I strip a Dynafit factory insert I just fire in a Quverkiller. They seem to work fine in the Dynafit inserts. When installing Quiverkiller in the Dynafit ski I use the type of epoxy that’s enabled for plastic.”

    I’m thinking about getting a pair of Stokes and mounting them with QK / bindingfreedom inserts, etc. with dual intentions. One, to improve pull out strength (as discussed). Thoughts on this? Will the inserts improve pull out strength? Will the connection be stronger than the plug? Two: to swap bindings.

    To reiterate, assuming it is worth mounting the inserts, do so with plastic epoxy as per above or any update or change.

    Also, any upcoming review on the new Green Machines? I can only wait so long until I make a completely irrational gear purchase. Especially interested in a TLT5P vs. GM comparo…

  152. Sandy Detillieux November 12th, 2011 9:02 pm

    I’m sorry if this has already been answered above, but I didn’t see it being addressed.

    I am very interested in installing inserts (either Quiver Killer of Binding Freedom) into a bunch of my skis. Is this gonna be possible with my Manaslus- on the plate?

    If so, how?

    Thanks a bunch
    Sandy

  153. Sandy Detillieux November 13th, 2011 9:26 am

    Sorry, I meant to type “or” Binding Freedom
    Also, I have Maestrale boots with BSL 322
    Bindings are the older “vertical” series- either ST or the FT

  154. Robin November 13th, 2011 9:33 am

    Shouldn’t be a problem.

    Some pix from when i did the same.

    https://picasaweb.google.com/113437974048240330442/Div#

  155. Sandy Detillieux November 13th, 2011 9:42 am

    Thanks a bunch Robin
    I’m really excited about this.
    For some reason I assumed that I’d have to flip my Manaslus if I wanted to use QK/BM inserts. But I REALLY like my Manaslus!

    Sandy

  156. Sandy Detillieux November 13th, 2011 10:11 am

    Back in November people were talking about what to do with unused Manaslu holes

    Jonathan Shefftz said, “Why not JB Weld? Wouldn’t that be more secure than duct tape, but allow the hole to be reused unlike epoxy?”

    Is this accurate?
    filling the hole with JB Weld would eliminate any potential problems of water expanding when frozen, but also allowing the hole to be re-used for future use?

    Thanks again
    Sandy

  157. Sandy Detillieux November 13th, 2011 10:21 am

    Lou, back on August 10th, 2011 @ 6:59 AM, you said that you, “use the type of epoxy that’s enabled for plastic” on the Manaslu.
    Would this type of epoxy be less than ideal for use on other skis?

    Thanks
    Sandy

  158. Lou November 14th, 2011 7:14 am

    Sandy, it’s really not a big deal, but I’d suggest not using plastic enabled epoxy on holes other than the Dynafit plastic inserts, due to the faint possibility that whatever “etching” chemical in the plastic epoxy might interact in a negative way with internal ski resins and such. Thus, if it’s just a plain old hole in the ski, that you want to fill, just use JB quick or 1-hour epoxy. Don’t use regular JB Weld, as it takes a long time to cure and while curing could attack some ski resins and such. Above simply my opinion, nothing to obsess on. I’ve actually filled ski holes with just about everything from Gorilla Glue to tooth paste, and only had problems with the tooth paste. Lou

  159. Sandy Detillieux November 15th, 2011 8:37 pm

    Lou, do you have a product in mind when you say to use a “plastic enabled epoxy”? What kind of plastic are we talking about- PVC, ABS, polycarbonate?

    Thanks again
    Sandy

  160. Lou November 15th, 2011 8:40 pm

    Sandy, at hardware stores they sell “plastic epoxy” of different brands. It sticks to some kinds of plastic, but doesn’t have much grab on things like nylon, so it’s perhaps of limited effectiveness when used to do things like placing aftermarket inserts in Dynafit factory inserts. Nonetheless, it seems like a good idea to use it instead of regular epoxy. Not a big deal. Lou

  161. Kyle November 9th, 2012 8:28 am

    I put binding freedom inserts in a pair of manaslu’s i picked up: http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php/253072-Manaslu-Binding-Freedom

    I’ll post more when I have skiied them.

  162. Bob December 7th, 2013 10:39 am

    Getting ready to mount TLT Vertical on the Dynafit stoke. Wouldn’t it be best to pre-drill the plastic plugged hole with a under sized bit first? This would allow room to get the epoxy in the hole before the screw goes in and would put less torque on the plastic insert so it doesn’t spin while screwing the binding down.
    If you don’t pre-drill do you run the screw in and then back it out to add epoxy or just put epoxy on the screw first?

    Thanks for all the info, this will be my first season “over on the dark side”

  163. Lou Dawson December 7th, 2013 11:09 am

    Bob, what you want to do is drill each insert with a regular ski bit, that cleans any left over resin and opens the skin over the hole, but doesn’t enlarge the hole past the correct diameter. If you use epoxy, be SURE to soften with heat before binding removal, otherwise you can get an insert that’s a spinner. Whatever you do, don’t enlarge the existing holes! They are the correct diameter for the screw threads. Lou

  164. Bob December 7th, 2013 6:24 pm

    Thanks Lou,

    I was a little confused as in your original blog you say they do not need to be drilled, so I thought using an under sized drill bit and then let the screw cut the rest of the hole would be easier then not drilling at all.

    Thanks again ,
    Montana Bob

  165. SteveG December 7th, 2013 8:43 pm

    I have had to repair 4 spinners on an early Manaslu. Drill as Lou suggests and you can’t lose.

  166. Lou Dawson December 8th, 2013 7:09 am

    Bob, apologies for any confusion. Difficult to keep all the info 999 up to date.

    I have a Manaslu here that I spun an insert out of because I got lazy and didn’t heat the screw before removal. Repairing with JBweld and perhaps a steel insert. Hassle. My fault.

    Lou

  167. Bob March 17th, 2014 2:55 pm

    Is there a Dynafit Binding that uses the front and center hole on the toe piece that is pictured on the Manaslu ski?

  168. Robin March 17th, 2014 2:58 pm

    Bob: Dynafit before the Radical series used also the fifth hole.

    For exampel Dyanfit Vertical FT/ST, Speed and so on.

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Welcome to Louis (Lou) Dawson's backcountry skiing information opinion website and e magazine. Lou's passion for the past 45 years has been alpinism, climbing, mountaineering and skiing -- along with all manner of outdoor recreation. He has authored numerous books and articles about backcountry skiing and is well known as the first person to ski down all 54 of Colorado's 14,000-foot peaks, otherwise known as the Fourteeners! Books and free back country news and information here, and tons of Randonnee rando telemark info.

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Backcountry skiing is a dangerous sport. You may be killed or severely injured if you do any form of ski mountaineering, skimo randonnee and randonnée skiing. The information and news on this website is intended only as general information. While the authors and editors of the information on this website make every effort to present useful information about ski mountaineering, due to human error the information, text and images contained within this website may be inaccurate, false, or out-of-date. By using, reading or viewing the information provided on this website, you agree to absolve the owners of Wild Snow as well as content contributors of any liability for injuries or losses incurred while using such information. Furthermore, you agree to use any of this website's information, maps, photos, or binding mounting instructions or templates at your own risk, and waive Wild Snow its owners and contributors of any liability for use of said items for backcountry skiing or any other use.

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